Shrimpsvoices

Just heard that the England manager (remind me who was he.. ) got £14 million over the 4 years he was the England manager.

Not a bad pay packet for being a failure.....

Its an English disease, probably as well we never played France and scabbed it to the semi's as we'd all think we were a good team and he would have got another 4 year deal.

Don't like losing to the French anyway.....so there

Christies Child wrote:Just heard that the England manager (remind me who was he.. ) got £14 million over the 4 years he was the England manager.

Not a bad pay packet for being a failure.....

But he wasn't paid to be a failure. Would you be criticising if we'd (somehow) won the competition? Hindsight is a wonderful thing eh?

Paid by results preferably....but that's a high price to pay for abject failure.

Christies Child wrote:Paid by results preferably....but that's a high price to pay for abject failure.

They wouldn't get anyone prepared to manage England if paid by results

Looking at various analyses of the reasons for England's dire performances, one thing that keeps coming up is that they had no plan, no identity, no understanding of what the manager wanted them to do. Basically they tried to constantly change their "game-plan" depending as to who the opposition were.
NOW .............. to me that sounds rather familiar and appropriate to MFC. So, come on Jim, please take note and try to do things in a different way this next season. Let's have a clear identity, let's stick to the way we play and let others worry about us. If not, then I fear that you will following "Woy" out the door, and MFC could well be destined to drop out of the league.

And incidentally Jim, I am not implying that you have been paid £14 million!!

cyprus-shrimp wrote:Looking at various analyses of the reasons for England's dire performances, one thing that keeps coming up is that they had no plan, no identity, no understanding of what the manager wanted them to do. Basically they tried to constantly change their "game-plan" depending as to who the opposition were.
NOW .............. to me that sounds rather familiar and appropriate to MFC. So, come on Jim, please take note and try to do things in a different way this next season. Let's have a clear identity, let's stick to the way we play and let others worry about us. If not, then I fear that you will following "Woy" out the door, and MFC could well be destined to drop out of the league.

And incidentally Jim, I am not implying that you have been paid £14 million!!

But does that qualification mean you are implying he's been a failure?

cyprus-shrimp wrote:Looking at various analyses of the reasons for England's dire performances, one thing that keeps coming up is that they had no plan, no identity, no understanding of what the manager wanted them to do. Basically they tried to constantly change their "game-plan" depending as to who the opposition were.
NOW .............. to me that sounds rather familiar and appropriate to MFC. So, come on Jim, please take note and try to do things in a different way this next season. Let's have a clear identity, let's stick to the way we play and let others worry about us. If not, then I fear that you will following "Woy" out the door, and MFC could well be destined to drop out of the league.

And incidentally Jim, I am not implying that you have been paid £14 million!!

Having problems deciding if that's being Negative or Realistic.....

Tinkering doesn't work if you have players of limited capability, they heed to be very fit and know exactly what they are doing, an organised hard working team, well drilled and, frankly , boring to watch , thats a sound recipe for safety.

My main point was that Jim spends a huge amount of time preparing his team to meet the needs of countering the opposition, but I believe that the focus should be on how WE play, and letting the other teams worry about us.

And no I don't think that Jim has done a bad job; it's just that it is my belief that he could do better, if he didn't chop and change the team so much. Maybe this year he won't have that luxury!!!

cyprus-shrimp wrote:My main point was that Jim spends a huge amount of time preparing his team to meet the needs of countering the opposition, but I believe that the focus should be on how WE play, and letting the other teams worry about us.

+1

Get confident, let them worry about us instead of always worrying about the oposition and trying to keep a clean sheet at teams like Dagenham, who were being tonked every week until we worried about them!

I'm with Ian Wright, it's Internatinal football, if the criteria to play for England is to be English then that should apply to the Managment.

also Rio Ferdinand regarding we've no identity.

I met Stuart Pearce at the trimple club, saying we need to be creating a wining mentality. saying we need to take the under 18s n 21s serious, like Ross Barkley we lost him to the senior teams over 3years ago, and he's hardly been played, and he never played at all in our pathetic attempt at Euro16.

I'm actually with Danny Baker who summed it up nicely with this 'tweet':

"Can we now all agree that the England team are not in
transition, not rebuilding, Not a 'young side'
They are just: No F****ng good."

Ridiculous statement. This is a young and inexperienced team with plenty of potential. Iceland have reached the quarters and Wales the semis, yet we undoubtedly have better players to pick from. Wales play as a team and have an identity. The players know the tactics and what is expected of them. Chris Coleman picks his strongest eleven based on form and plays players in their preferred positions. A very limited Greece team won Euro 2004, they had an identity, clear tactics and played to their strengths. It's the players who have come in for a lot of criticism but the majority of them will be selected for the next two major tournaments, so we need to get the best out of them. Roy was unable to do this, and he should take the majority of the blame for an amateurish approach to the tournament. This England squad is full of players who have had brilliant seasons in the PL but they looked very ordinary for England. They appeared to be confused and uncertain. Why did Roy change the formation at the start of the tournament? In qualifying we played a number of modest teams who sat back and tried to frustrate us, yet we always managed to break them down and win the match. We get to the tournament and Roy changes the formation, tactics and personnel and we looked lost. Why did he persist with the jaded Kane and the out of form Sterling? Why take the unfit Henderson and Wilshere?

Moving forward I would like to see us keep things simple. I don't believe we need a tactical genius as manager. Decide on a style of football that suits the players we have and stick with it. Play players in their preferred positions, if their position has been taken they don't get in the team. Pick players on form, not reputation. I would like to see the people of England get a vote on who they want to be the next manager. Every time a manager is chosen by the FA it is never the fans choice and it ends up in failure. I get fed up of watching passive England managers sat on the bench scratching their chins. I would love to see Pardew get it.

Teams like Morecambe wrote:
Moving forward I would like to see us keep things simple. I don't believe we need a tactical genius as manager. Decide on a style of football that suits the players we have and stick with it. Play players in their preferred positions, if their position has been taken they don't get in the team. Pick players on form, not reputation. I would like to see the people of England get a vote on who they want to be the next manager. Every time a manager is chosen by the FA it is never the fans choice and it ends up in failure. I get fed up of watching passive England managers sat on the bench scratching their chins. I would love to see Pardew get it.

yes.

personaly i would like Sam Allerdyce, or Tony Pulis, both good at getting the best out of what they've got, and passionate on the touch lines , but I cant see the FA doing so.

Glenn Hoddle is the man. It won't happen though.

Gone_Shrimping wrote:Glenn Hoddle is the man. It won't happen though.

errrr nah, he's another one who tinkerers .

remember him in France 98 rotating Anderton and Beckham.

aswell ) putting Paul Scholes out wide in left midfield in some games.

aswell ) as dropping Gazza , and taking David Batty instead.

awell ) as bringing in faith healer Irene Drury, Ray Parlour sat down in a chair in the middle of the dressing room, and she put her hands on his head, so Ray Parlour joked and asked for a short back n sides then everyone started laughing apart from Glen Hoddle, Ray Parlour never played for England again..

George Dawes wrote:

Gone_Shrimping wrote:Glenn Hoddle is the man. It won't happen though.

errrr nah, he's another one who tinkerers .

remember him in France 98 rotating Anderton and Beckham.

aswell ) putting Paul Scholes out wide in left midfield in some games.

aswell ) as dropping Gazza , and taking David Batty instead.

awell ) as bringing in faith healer Irene Drury, Ray Parlour sat down in a chair in the middle of the dressing room, and she put her hands on his head, so Ray Parlour joked and asked for a short back n sides then everyone started laughing apart from Glen Hoddle, Ray Parlour never played for England again..

Well Ray Parlour should never have been near an England squad in the first place !

Gazza also was well past his best.

I think you will find that Hoddle's win % is up there with the best :-

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j& ... b0NV41eTSw

Teams like Morecambe wrote:Ridiculous statement. This is a young and inexperienced team with plenty of potential. Iceland have reached the quarters and Wales the semis, yet we undoubtedly have better players to pick from. Wales play as a team and have an identity. The players know the tactics and what is expected of them. Chris Coleman picks his strongest eleven based on form and plays players in their preferred positions. A very limited Greece team won Euro 2004, they had an identity, clear tactics and played to their strengths. It's the players who have come in for a lot of criticism but the majority of them will be selected for the next two major tournaments, so we need to get the best out of them. Roy was unable to do this, and he should take the majority of the blame for an amateurish approach to the tournament. This England squad is full of players who have had brilliant seasons in the PL but they looked very ordinary for England. They appeared to be confused and uncertain. Why did Roy change the formation at the start of the tournament? In qualifying we played a number of modest teams who sat back and tried to frustrate us, yet we always managed to break them down and win the match. We get to the tournament and Roy changes the formation, tactics and personnel and we looked lost. Why did he persist with the jaded Kane and the out of form Sterling? Why take the unfit Henderson and Wilshere?

Moving forward I would like to see us keep things simple. I don't believe we need a tactical genius as manager. Decide on a style of football that suits the players we have and stick with it. Play players in their preferred positions, if their position has been taken they don't get in the team. Pick players on form, not reputation. I would like to see the people of England get a vote on who they want to be the next manager. Every time a manager is chosen by the FA it is never the fans choice and it ends up in failure. I get fed up of watching passive England managers sat on the bench scratching their chins. I would love to see Pardew get it.

Possibly and the above is even more ridiculous."Moving forward"! They can't go any further backwards ?
To lose to ICELAND, yes ICELAND in a competitive match ; it shouldn't really matter whose in charge, players of the supposive quality of Rooney, Hart, Kane et al shouldn't need that much managing.
Its passion and commitment thats missing in bucketfuls.
Bring in another manager, God knows who, and he'll probably pick a similar squad and get similar results.
The majority of them think they are world class and its simply a matter of turning up, hence they'll get turned over by just about anybody.
It looked to me like they were on an end of season 'jolly' and got the shock of their lives when they realised Iceland could play a bit.
The Welsh lads don't have the big reputations and salaries to match, bar one, but they have a massive team spirit / heart , just look at them celebrating together at the end of the Belgium match.
A vote by English people to pick the next England manager ?? Not sure about that one.
But its a massive job to get a decent English national team in my opinion, a complete re build, anything less and I honestly think your kidding yourselves.
I can't honestly think of anyone . Is there somebody out there who would install a sense of national pride in players who desperately wanted to play for England; willing to upset the big egos that masquerade as 'world class footballers' ?

slackAlice2 wrote:

Teams like Morecambe wrote:Ridiculous statement. This is a young and inexperienced team with plenty of potential. Iceland have reached the quarters and Wales the semis, yet we undoubtedly have better players to pick from. Wales play as a team and have an identity. The players know the tactics and what is expected of them. Chris Coleman picks his strongest eleven based on form and plays players in their preferred positions. A very limited Greece team won Euro 2004, they had an identity, clear tactics and played to their strengths. It's the players who have come in for a lot of criticism but the majority of them will be selected for the next two major tournaments, so we need to get the best out of them. Roy was unable to do this, and he should take the majority of the blame for an amateurish approach to the tournament. This England squad is full of players who have had brilliant seasons in the PL but they looked very ordinary for England. They appeared to be confused and uncertain. Why did Roy change the formation at the start of the tournament? In qualifying we played a number of modest teams who sat back and tried to frustrate us, yet we always managed to break them down and win the match. We get to the tournament and Roy changes the formation, tactics and personnel and we looked lost. Why did he persist with the jaded Kane and the out of form Sterling? Why take the unfit Henderson and Wilshere?

Moving forward I would like to see us keep things simple. I don't believe we need a tactical genius as manager. Decide on a style of football that suits the players we have and stick with it. Play players in their preferred positions, if their position has been taken they don't get in the team. Pick players on form, not reputation. I would like to see the people of England get a vote on who they want to be the next manager. Every time a manager is chosen by the FA it is never the fans choice and it ends up in failure. I get fed up of watching passive England managers sat on the bench scratching their chins. I would love to see Pardew get it.

Possibly and the above is even more ridiculous."Moving forward"! They can't go any further backwards ?
To lose to ICELAND, yes ICELAND in a competitive match ; it shouldn't really matter whose in charge, players of the supposive quality of Rooney, Hart, Kane et al shouldn't need that much managing.
Its passion and commitment thats missing in bucketfuls.
Bring in another manager, God knows who, and he'll probably pick a similar squad and get similar results.
The majority of them think they are world class and its simply a matter of turning up, hence they'll get turned over by just about anybody.
It looked to me like they were on an end of season 'jolly' and got the shock of their lives when they realised Iceland could play a bit.
The Welsh lads don't have the big reputations and salaries to match, bar one, but they have a massive team spirit / heart , just look at them celebrating together at the end of the Belgium match.
A vote by English people to pick the next England manager ?? Not sure about that one.
But its a massive job to get a decent English national team in my opinion, a complete re build, anything less and I honestly think your kidding yourselves.
I can't honestly think of anyone . Is there somebody out there who would install a sense of national pride in players who desperately wanted to play for England; willing to upset the big egos that masquerade as 'world class footballers' ?

Alan Shearer?

I think a big problem we've always had is that our players are high-earners and high-profile with big egos, so we think they need managing by a manager with a reputation on the European stage, or an ex player "who's been there and done it", otherwise these big egos won't respect him. We never give the job to someone who has simply put together a hard working team, not full of stars, who know their jobs and do it.
But our players are only high profile because they play in a very lucrative league, not because they're World class. Like the Italian team, not many superstars there, they realise that and are managed like a league side. Good system, all know their jobs and do them, like Teams like Morecambe said.

Pick players to do a job. Townsend is the best right winger we have, he stayed at home and we pushed three central strikers into that position in different games just to get them in the side. Clueless. I like the way Sean Dyche always gets his side playing to the absolute best of their ability. He'd take no nonsense from any egos and would pick a side to do a job. He's not high profile enough yet but I think he's going to get a bigger club in a few years. He'd be the type to do the job we need.

I posted earlier that the Burnley manager was the kind we needed. Not often that Shrimpers and I agree but....always a first:-)

shrimper wrote:
Pick players to do a job. Townsend is the best right winger we have, he stayed at home and we pushed three central strikers into that position in different games just to get them in the side. Clueless.

I would have took him, plays brilliant for England.

like how Germany always stick with players who don't let them down, dispite club form

like Podolski and Gomez in Euro 16, and Klose in recent Wirld Cups, even though he's not always a regular at his club .

This problem of England players thinking they are better than they are is so true.
They only look good in the Premier League cos they are in teams which have talented world class European footballers who make those teams tick.
But the root cause is embedded in the culture of our society in this country.
I have watched a lot of football from under Elevens through to under Eighteens, and particularly with the under Eighteens, some players,but not all, have a cocky attitude towards the game.
Yes,they have talent and potential, but they fall short in attitude and commitment,and some of them can't take any constructive criticism; they are fine when it is all going their way,but they won't roll their sleeves up when it gets a little tougher.
I must emphasise that this is not true of a lot of these talented teenagers, who have the desire and commitment and do try their best, but I do think that the malaise in the English national team does stretch back down to youth football in this country.
It's the mental side of the game that lets us down all the time, that's why Germany, Italy, France,Wales and Iceland are so far ahead of us at present.