O/T We'll fight them on the prom

[Posh]

...and another thing

I've always argued that Morecambe needs to go upmarket with the Midland and the new development we've got a real opportunity to get a huge jump on Blackpool.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/lanc ... 499226.stm

[Keith]

i have not said i was against it i said 500 flats /bedsits and a hotel are a bit too much for the prom

We don't want 500 young professionals, with money to spend, moving to Morecambe?
Some how, I get the impression US won't be asking you to market their "flats" for them, "luxury apartments with a fantastic panoramic views across the most beautiful bay in Britain, towards the Cumbrian fells" sounds a little more enticing than "a bedsit in Morecambe"...

If US can build apartments that attract close to 700 professional people, who have a large percentage of disposable income, to live in the town, that will be a FANTASTIC development, which as already stated, would bring in the service industries to go with it. The bypass will actually put Morecambe within commuting distance of Manchester. The town could be looking up... I'm with Mark, you've got a company with a proven track record for delivery, wanting to invest in the town, how is it even a point of discussion? Give them the eye sore and let them do something useful with it.

If it goes ahead, what do people think will be the final figure for the number of flats? I'd go for 350.

[Phoenix]

But the people locally did elect them. so if they force urban splash away it will simply be a matter of you reap what you sow.

You've no idea who I voted for! Maybe I voted for someone that had this town at heart but there weren't enough like-minded people in my ward? I'm repeating myself here but local councils shouldn't be about politics and tit-for-tat voting, it should be about local people running the town as the locals want it and even referendums for something as major as this.

[Shrimpsscene]

...and another thing

I've always argued that Morecambe needs to go upmarket with the Midland and the new development we've got a real opportunity to get a huge jump on Blackpool.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/lanc ... 499226.stm

good post there Mike
and its a very good idea for blackpool to go upmarket which perhaps we could latch onto
we need much more development in the resort
lots of retail space will become empty in blackpool as exisiting retailers move into the developed houndshill centre...Next will be leaving as other big shops will be
obne thing you may not be aware of is that the blackpool and fylde college campus in bispham
is moving into the town centre next to the football ground
lots of landlords are doing up properties and some looking to convert guest house accommodation into student accommodation
the old mecca building on central drive will be demolished jobs created a new campus in the town centre will give their local economy a boost

i like what urban splash have done and echo marks sentiments
would love to see more good shops in the resort starting with marks and spencers!!!
as for new flats hope they would still advertise a jug of tea for £1.50 in the bars!!!

[Freez]

Resort?

An outdated label surely?

Seaside Town possibly?

Forget holidays and tourists, make it a great place to live and they will come to stay also!

[shrimper]

I actually think we have a massive headstart and huge advantages over Blackpool in some important respects. For Blackpool to start attracting - and I know this sounds horribly snobby - a 'better' class of visitor, they need first to move away from the 'tackier' side of their tourism offer and there is a heck of a lot of what people might describe as that.
By 'better class' I really only mean people who appreciate the beauty of a place and respect and enjoy it.
And at the end of it all, they don't have the superb view that we will always have.
We've already got our 'regeneration' underway and improving buildings and making any new shops etc of high quality is part of that.
But, in order to really progress, we need to remove the untidy buildings and plots of land - the sort of aspects that would deter those more discerning visitors from making repeat visits - the types who might go to Lancaster and the Lakes and then fancy a day or two by the seaside.
We also need to provide them with more to do in terms of eating out, drinking in nice bars and enjoying quality entertainment.

Now, there is an argument that says you should just level and landscape any land that is not currently pristine. That's fine and for me and everyone else who lives here it would at least make the place look nicer.
But I don't think it would bring us much more development in the way of a marina, shops, restaurants, bars etc.
To bring that about we need to tidy the place up, yes, but we DO, in my opinion, also need a new influx of people with a vested interest in making the place more vibrant 365 days a year (and that's the key) - not just when the weather's nice.
And that means new residents (permanent or of the 'holiday home' type), either migrating from Lancaster and the wider district, or from further afield. That creates a whole new resident market that drives the new developments most people say they want.
The crux is, it seems, how we go about achieving that, where any new accommodation should be sited and what form it should take.
We may get a 'take it or leave it' from a developer (and we make our choice accordingly) or there may be room for discussion and compromise.

[Freez]

Am I politically naive in expecting clear thinking, discussion and compromise to be a given from both the council and developers in any situation such as this?

What worries me is the immediate knee jerk reaction against the proposal from the nay-sayers attracting much press. Now I understand this was done to open the debate and possibly to prompt the "pro-development" lobby into action, but far too often the half-interested dwellers of this town jump on the bandwagon in criticising change in any shape or form.

The Midland has provided so much positive publicity nationally, yet locally all I hear is petty complaints and moaning about the service.
Would these people rather we knock it down and start again?
In time, US will get the Midland to where it wants and needs to be.

It appears to this sand grown 'un that the motto for many of the residents and so called politicos of our town should be
"I'm only happy when it rains!"

[Posh]

But, in order to really progress, we need to remove the untidy buildings and plots of land - the sort of aspects that would deter those more discerning visitors from making repeat visits - the types who might go to Lancaster and the Lakes and then fancy a day or two by the seaside.
We also need to provide them with more to do in terms of eating out, drinking in nice bars and enjoying quality entertainment.

Sounds fantastic in practice but in reality vested interests will stop it happening in Blackpool and it will be a problem here. In Blackpool, I think its the Cook family own a lot of land in central Blackpool from which they make a fortune on slot machines and selling tat. I'd love to see someone tell them they need to give all that up and open something else. Anyway Blackpool's a dog and without the casino it'll continue to be a God awful place.

In Morecambe the problem, in my view, is three-fold, firstly absentee landlords. They will rent out their sea-front commercial properties to the highest payer and many couldn't give a stuff who uses it. They also don't care about the frontage. The biggest villains for me are the furniture shop on the corner of Northumberland Street, just appalling and dumps his stuff onto the pavement;the arcade between Hitchins and Woolworths - atrocious; Hitchins itself is getting in a poor state both outside and in; Queen Street is just a blot on the face of the planet; and there are several others. The council needs to enforce orders to clean up the prom and neighbouring streets.

Second are the businesses which cater for down the pecking order who would be unlikely to change. This includes poor-quality bed and breakfasts; hotels that haven't had a makeover since the 1950s; and, probably worst of all, amusement arcades. More of the soft play areas like in Johnny's Fun Factory and less of the machines would make a big difference.

Finally, just too much retail spaces. It is difficult for the council to manage this but Morecambe needs a greater concentration of retail outlets and the closure of vast swathes of shops. A quick trip down Regent Road, Albert Road, Heysham Road (between the Battery and Fairfield Road), Queen Street, Euston Road or Victoria Street and you'll quickly see what I mean. There are so many empty, derelict and dreadful propoerties. If there were less then good businesses wouldn't stuck between two poor properties and suffer. I'd even say they would pay higher rents to be on a parade of thriving well-kept shops.

[Phoenix]

If Evelyn's week in the Arndale stretches to Saturday, I'm going to pay her a visit in the morning. Lots of questions if she'll give me the time of day.

[Phoenix]

I wasn't sad to see Morecambe's Burger King go, crap food and crap service. Glad it did now :

http://www.lakelandecho.co.uk/morecambe ... 4279599.jp

[Phoenix]

Detailed plans for the first two buildings, close to the Midland and rising to five storeys high, have been lodged with Lancaster City Council But hundreds of people are queuing up to sign letters of protest against the scheme before the July 18 deadline.
The protest is being led by Cllr Evelyn Archer, Lancaster City Council’s Cabinet member with responsibility for regeneration in Morecambe and chair of the influential Friends of the Winter Gardens.

I wonder if there was the option to sign to say we DO want the development? This isn't canvassing, it's a protest by a councillor. Disgraceful.

Have your say on the planning applications online:

http://planapps.lancaster.gov.uk/public ... htype=SPEC

Don't let Evelyn get away with it this time, use the I DO NOT OBJECT button and let them know. What really pissed me off is the link on the planning application page to my local councillors so I can discuss it with them. Who's my local councillor and lives round the corner from me? Evelyn Archer Well, I can assure everyone that I did not vote for Evelyn.

Sack the board!

[halfwayliner]

Have you found out if Evelyn is going to the arndale centre today

[Keith]

Sounds fantastic in practice but in reality...

Just put it into practice anyway...

[Shrimpsscene]

But, in order to really progress, we need to remove the untidy buildings and plots of land - the sort of aspects that would deter those more discerning visitors from making repeat visits - the types who might go to Lancaster and the Lakes and then fancy a day or two by the seaside.
We also need to provide them with more to do in terms of eating out, drinking in nice bars and enjoying quality entertainment.

Sounds fantastic in practice but in reality vested interests will stop it happening in Blackpool and it will be a problem here. In Blackpool, I think its the Cook family own a lot of land in central Blackpool from which they make a fortune on slot machines and selling tat. I'd love to see someone tell them they need to give all that up and open something else. Anyway Blackpool's a dog and without the casino it'll continue to be a God awful place.

In Morecambe the problem, in my view, is three-fold, firstly absentee landlords. They will rent out their sea-front commercial properties to the highest payer and many couldn't give a stuff who uses it. They also don't care about the frontage. The biggest villains for me are the furniture shop on the corner of Northumberland Street, just appalling and dumps his stuff onto the pavement;the arcade between Hitchins and Woolworths - atrocious; Hitchins itself is getting in a poor state both outside and in; Queen Street is just a blot on the face of the planet; and there are several others. The council needs to enforce orders to clean up the prom and neighbouring streets.

Second are the businesses which cater for down the pecking order who would be unlikely to change. This includes poor-quality bed and breakfasts; hotels that haven't had a makeover since the 1950s; and, probably worst of all, amusement arcades. More of the soft play areas like in Johnny's Fun Factory and less of the machines would make a big difference.

Finally, just too much retail spaces. It is difficult for the council to manage this but Morecambe needs a greater concentration of retail outlets and the closure of vast swathes of shops. A quick trip down Regent Road, Albert Road, Heysham Road (between the Battery and Fairfield Road), Queen Street, Euston Road or Victoria Street and you'll quickly see what I mean. There are so many empty, derelict and dreadful propoerties. If there were less then good businesses wouldn't stuck between two poor properties and suffer. I'd even say they would pay higher rents to be on a parade of thriving well-kept shops.

http://www.lancaster.gov.uk/Documents/P ... 046-95.pdf

pages 34 onwards on what the plan sets out fo rmorecambes retail areas and what developments are allowed....the areas you talk about mike could be changesd to residential use it would seem places like bottom of heysham road
and as you say why not concentrate the shops in better clusters

[Phoenix]

Evelyn is there and I made myself known, she was expecting me and I wouldn't be surprised if she's not already aware of this message. First of all, Evelyn is reading these messages so hello Evelyn from a member of your ward, Brian Sheldon. There, no hiding behind an alias now is there, I'm not faceless any more. Feel free to join in, we don't just have "I Support" paperwork available on here.

The main view objected to is that from the restaurant at the top of the Winter Gardens which will be facing a 3-storey Urban Splash building, not 7-storey. Evelyn admitted she signed the paperwork for the Winter Gardens. I said that as a restaurant I would have to pay to see this view, Evelyn said I wouldn't as anyone would be able to go and see the view from the balcony. Let's all remember that in a few years time when it opens.

I asked if, as councillor for my ward, my opinion in support of the plans would be put forward by her. Straight answer, no. Evelyn will put the view of the majority forward. I asked how could I put my opinion to the council, "you'll have to do it yourself".

Is this a protest organisation? "No". Looking at the A4 sheets available to sign on the stand, a very simple one-liner containing "I object". There were no "I support" letters available. This leads to the question how does Evelyn know the view of the majority? The objectors can be formally counted but if Evelyn has not written down my one vote in favour, whatever the majority view is cannot be proved.

We didn't lose our tempers but Evelyn made the point a few times she didn't like what is being said on here. Personally I don't like what is being said and influenced by my local councillor.

How many times have I typed on here that I don't agree with politics locally. So how on earth can Evelyn stand there and say "you must be one of those other colours, a red or something". What better evidence can you find of petty tit-for-tat local politics. That's exactly what I don't want to see from anyone on the council.

Keith should also be proud it seems Evelyn knows more about this forum than she does the Visitor and Citizen. When I repeated the Visitor's comment that she was canvassing in the Arndale, she wasn't aware of it. Nor was she aware that the Citizen said she was protesting in the Arndale. When I said I'd offered my opinion for the front page of a local paper (see earlier in this thread) but it didn't make it, "Aww, what a shame".

if you're going to join in this thread, perhaps you can sign off with your proper name so we can't be accused of being faceless, whatever your opinion.

[Christies Child]

Looks to me as though she doesn't like opposition.

What about free speech?

The Visitor proved this week that the so-called view of the Bay isn't actually viewable as it is.

May I suggest that she stops trying to stop an excellent development but concentrates on the Winter Gardens. After all how many years has it been that we've been hearing about its re-birth?

Maybe she should take a trip to Southport and look what private money has done to their sea front.

Neil Roebuck

[Phoenix]

Well put Neil. The plans are quite amazing, developments panning out into the sea with the midland as the hub.

Something else I forgot to mention, the plans include narrowing the main road along that stretch of the promenade which Evelyn said was another of her objections. There was no answer to my question what difference is that to the rest of the main road between midland and gala bingo narrowed by the council.

I was hoping to have a longer chat with Evelyn but someone else walked up and she turned her back on me mid sentence.

[Keith]

May I suggest that she stops trying to stop an excellent development but concentrates on the Winter Gardens.

To be fair, I think her objection to the Urban Splash development is because she is concentrating on the Winter Gardens. It's just that I believe she is concentrating upon that one aspect to the detriment of the rest of the town.

I never did get a clear understanding about why the MBI's objected to the proposed bypass, at least I understand 'why' she's objecting to this proposal. But it becomes NIMBYism on a grander scale. If the Winter Gardens weren't in that position, would she complain that the view from Hitchin's store room would be compromised? I would say that the view from the restaurant being (slightly) changed should be taken in to account but that on balance, the new development will bring more revenue and prosperity to the town and I'd also be amazed if the number of customers attracted to the Winter Gardens restaurant would be affected because of the development, purely because the better view would never be in that direction.

Lastly, US have a track record of delivering on their plans while, with the greatest respect, the Winter Gardens have been getting saved for many decades now, so again, for the good of the town, it makes sense to go with the development that is most likely to be successful and that will bring the greater value to the town in general.

[Phoenix]

To be fair, I think her objection to the Urban Splash development is because she is concentrating on the Winter Gardens. It's just that I believe she is concentrating upon that one aspect to the detriment of the rest of the town.

My thoughts exactly after this morning. Blinkered is a phrase I'd use.

"Winter Gardens funding will be in place in two years". OK Evelyn .....

Next time you take a stroll down the prom, think about the view. The lake views are towards the end of the Bay, straight across and to the right. To the left you're looking towards Ulverston and Barrow, not famed for their lakeland hills. The Winter Gardens is on the right hand edge of the development plans where the free-to-enter-winter-gardens-viewing-gallery would have an un-hindered view to the right.

[campdave]

No1 in today's guardian 100 British Breaks: Morecambe

Try telling me that would still be the case if US hadn't been involved with the Midland.

[Phoenix]

When the development is complete we will have a new promenade and new views. The only view that might be spoiled is that of a restaurant that hasn't got planning permission in a theatre that has been closed for 31 years.

The theatre as it is now has no grounds to claim loss of view, the balcony where this view exists is not a public access area, nor has it ever been as far as I have been able to find out. Anyone involved in the theatre really should make this commercial interest known.

Isn't google amazing;

[Evelyn Archer] One of the things that puts people off coming to Morecambe is that they're sat in traffic coming from Lancaster to Morecambe, so we really need a bypass, that's important to us
http://www.csi.mmu.ac.uk/sitami/media/m ... cript.html

and in a vote over the bypass;

HOW THEY VOTED
AGAINST: Evelyn Archer
http://www.lancasterguardian.co.uk/fron ... 2988976.jp

I like this page as well
http://themarpleleaf.blogspot.com/2008/ ... -best.html

[Joel Ninety]

Maybe Urban Splash should get hold of the Winter Gardens, I think they've done a great jon on the Midland. In fact let them redevelop the whole town. I am a big fan of their work.

As previously mentioned, we would not be anywhere near number 1 in the Guardian's British Breaks list without all the publicity for the Midland and other plans.

[Phoenix]

Joel, while you're online telling us your thoughts, please don't forget to tell the council. At the moment the only feedback being encouraged are objections.

http://planapps.lancaster.gov.uk/public ... htype=SPEC

[morecambe mick]

Joel, while you're online telling us your thoughts, please don't forget to tell the council. At the moment the only feedback being encouraged are objections.

http://planapps.lancaster.gov.uk/public ... htype=SPEC

Done.

In support of planning application.

I couldn't see the bit where US take over Winter Gardens or would have done that too.

[Rob]

Joel, while you're online telling us your thoughts, please don't forget to tell the council. At the moment the only feedback being encouraged are objections.

http://planapps.lancaster.gov.uk/public ... htype=SPEC

Also done.

Whilst your at it may be worth contacting the local mp to support the project. Replacing the end with your own postcode.

http://www.writetothem.com/write?who=1881&pc=LA3+1BQ