The shit ref database

[CityShrimp]

Interesting post, Keith, and interesting thread.

I think most Morecambe fans, in the cold light of day, can understand why Murphy was sent off. But it was down to interpretation and I think most of the frustration was with the footballing gods rather than the referee that another one went against us when, on another day, and if we were a big team with a big intimidating crowd, it might not have been a red.

[Keith]

I think there is an inconsistency, such as the player at Hartlepool (I think) who did a worse tackle and it wasn't even a free-kick. We do appear to be 'in deficit' when it comes to contentious decisions, both this season & last. It *should* balance out over time, but it doesn't appear to be.

[Gone_Shrimping]

How did the referee v Cheltenham miss their player stamping on Kenyon but saw Kenyon flick his leg at the Cheltenham man.

[friedshrimp]

How did the referee v Cheltenham miss their player stamping on Kenyon but saw Kenyon flick his leg at the Cheltenham man.

As the risk of sounding as tedious as I probably am, the ref saw what hw saw in real time. He missed it. He made an error which, as I said in a previous post, really pissed me off as it was a game changer. However he simply didn't see it.

and Keith I wonder what wopuld have happened if you had done a similar strict applications of the laws of football to the one you did in hockey. You would have probably been chased off the park, all the way home and had your house torched. That would just have been for starters

[Keith]

and Keith I wonder what wopuld have happened if you had done a similar strict applications of the laws of football to the one you did in hockey. You would have probably been chased off the park, all the way home and had your house torched. That would just have been for starters

Not sure I'd call it a "strict application" of the rules, the rule book says (said?) that the process was that as described and an infringement by the striker results in a 16 yard hit, so no 'interpretation' is required.

As for what would have happened, yes, you're probably right, it would have been quite scary. Which is why I wrote in the other 'refs' thread, football needs to get its house in order.

[John L]

Tony Harrington.

Over to you, Fried shrimp...

[fulwoodshrimp]

Was Tony Harrington today's referee against Blackpool? If so he was very poor and very one-sided in his decision making. There was a clear foul on Fleming before Blackpool's second goal.He was your typical "homer" referee giving most of his decisions in favour of the home team. Another official that shouldn't be anywhere near the Football League imo.

[Sakhalin Shrimp]

Tony Harrington.

Over to you, Fried shrimp...

This could be interesting

[John L]

Was Tony Harrington today's referee against Blackpool? If so he was very poor and very one-sided in his decision making. There was a clear foul on Fleming before Blackpool's second goal.He was your typical "homer" referee giving most of his decisions in favour of the home team. Another official that shouldn't be anywhere near the Football League imo.

Yup!

[John L]

Tony Harrington.

Over to you, Fried shrimp...

This could be interesting

I really cannot wait!

[friedshrimp]

I would not want to disappoint.

Firstly I cannot comment on any specific reffing decisions from yesterday as I chose to respect the request from the Blackpool Trust. I understand their NAPM position and so stayed away. Sounds like it was a great atmosphere though. I shall have to wait for the next 2 home games to make specific decision arguments.

My main point is the same as before. Refs make many mistakes but that is all they are. The better refs make fewer mistakes. At present they have to make decisions in real time. I think much of the abuse that refs get is based on poor understanding of the laws of the game and serious bias. After all we all want our team to win. If you look back at the discussion around the Murphy tackle some people were making all sorts of claims about why it was not a foul before someone put up the freeze frame of the moment of impact. There was then a general, begrudging, acceptance that the ref actually got it right. Despite what the crowd were singing at the time, the ref DID know what he was doing. There is a lot of research out there that shows most of us are actually very unreliable as witnesses as we are often not sure what we have seen. What often then happens cognitively is that we think we have seen what we want to see. I think the skill the best refs have is that they are able to recall what they have seen more objectively. I think many passionate fans are poor at this.

The effect of this is serious for football (but not for Rugby, Hockey and other sports as previously discussed) because in football there is a general acceptance of abuse of the officials and some of it is vitriolic and abusive. Why would anyone do it? There are not enough refs to go round and a smaller people to choose people for promotion. This will inevitably mean fewer really good refs resulting in more abuse and then even fewer people coming forward to ref. The game is impossible without refs. I have never understood the general football fan narrative of 'its not fair', 'the ref was against us' or 'we were never going to get a decision from that ref'. I saw my first game 54 years ago and it has always seemed to be the same. Seems a bit childish to me!

[John L]

For me, the major issue with referees is that they are supposed to be the law enforcers of the game and so I would expect them and their assistants not to make such obvious mistakes. I'm not particularly biased either. It's more forgiveable for a player to have a bad game but the referee and his assistants have an absolute duty to police the game properly.

[fulwoodshrimp]

I understand there is a problem recruiting enough referees but that shouldn't mean they are as bad as the current batch coming through. Whatever we are doing to train and promote referees isn't working and we need to look again at the system. Several referees this season including yesterday's are not up to the task imo. He clearly favoured the home side in his decision making and how he didn't give the foul on Andy Fleming that led to Blackpool's second goal escapes me. I don't like a system where its ex-referees supporting the current crop and guiding them. It needs more objectivity and some ruthlessness. Referees that show themselves inadequate in the Football League seem to continue being inadequate. In my opinion they should be thrown off the list. This season the quality of the referee has decided the results of games. We have lost to Cheltenham, and Barnet particularly due to the referees and questionable decisions. It's not all been bad in a number of games this season the referee has been good but overall we need big changes and better selection and education for prospective referees.

[Gone_Shrimping]

Storer from Cheltenham who was the villain in the sending off of Alex Kenyon was himself sent off yesterday

[friedshrimp]

I understand there is a problem recruiting enough referees but that shouldn't mean they are as bad as the current batch coming through. Whatever we are doing to train and promote referees isn't working and we need to look again at the system. Several referees this season including yesterday's are not up to the task imo. He clearly favoured the home side in his decision making and how he didn't give the foul on Andy Fleming that led to Blackpool's second goal escapes me. I don't like a system where its ex-referees supporting the current crop and guiding them. It needs more objectivity and some ruthlessness. Referees that show themselves inadequate in the Football League seem to continue being inadequate. In my opinion they should be thrown off the list. This season the quality of the referee has decided the results of games. We have lost to Cheltenham, and Barnet particularly due to the referees and questionable decisions. It's not all been bad in a number of games this season the referee has been good but overall we need big changes and better selection and education for prospective referees.

Whatever changes are made I think there is still the fundamental problem of football being a hostile environment where personal abuse is accepted. Where are new and 'better' refs going to come from? who would want to do it? The other big change could be for football managers, players and crowds to show more emmotional maturity and accept the ups and downs without needing someone to blame. A sense of proprtion wouldn't go amiss. As the saying goes, no-one died.

I wasn't at the game but I am guessing that if we had a slowmotion replay of the Fleming incident we might well still debate whether it was a foul or not.

I would have thought ex-refs are the only ones with the experience to teach the next generation. how could someone teach who has never done it? On that basis I could manage morecambe no problem.

[Phoenix Shrimp 2017]

I understand there is a problem recruiting enough referees but that shouldn't mean they are as bad as the current batch coming through. Whatever we are doing to train and promote referees isn't working and we need to look again at the system. Several referees this season including yesterday's are not up to the task imo. He clearly favoured the home side in his decision making and how he didn't give the foul on Andy Fleming that led to Blackpool's second goal escapes me. I don't like a system where its ex-referees supporting the current crop and guiding them. It needs more objectivity and some ruthlessness. Referees that show themselves inadequate in the Football League seem to continue being inadequate. In my opinion they should be thrown off the list. This season the quality of the referee has decided the results of games. We have lost to Cheltenham, and Barnet particularly due to the referees and questionable decisions. It's not all been bad in a number of games this season the referee has been good but overall we need big changes and better selection and education for prospective referees.

Whatever changes are made I think there is still the fundamental problem of football being a hostile environment where personal abuse is accepted. Where are new and 'better' refs going to come from? who would want to do it? The other big change could be for football managers, players and crowds to show more emmotional maturity and accept the ups and downs without needing someone to blame. A sense of proprtion wouldn't go amiss. As the saying goes, no-one died.

I wasn't at the game but I am guessing that if we had a slowmotion replay of the Fleming incident we might well still debate whether it was a foul or not.

I would have thought ex-refs are the only ones with the experience to teach the next generation. how could someone teach who has never done it? On that basis I could manage morecambe no problem.

I think yesterdays ref got the majority of things right. On the day Blackpool had the edge on us most of the game in terms of physicality, natural ability and organisation. Potts is quality and was the stand out player on the pitch. I thought that our lads were trying to bridge the gap, albeit not massive, by pushing the boundaries of the rules just that bit more than Blackpool and it showed. The ref seemed to suss' that out early doors and consequently the majority of decisions thereafter went against us.

There are refs out there who have probably been promoted too soon (ref Sailsbury V Cheltenham a case in point), but if there are no officials then there is no football so sometimes I think you have to cut them a bit of slack. If refereeing was that easy then I think you'd see a lot more ex pro footballers taking it up, but I can't think of a single one and that's a shame because they understand the game and some would no doubt make excellent refs.

[Keith]

Referees that show themselves inadequate in the Football League seem to continue being inadequate. In my opinion they should be thrown off the list.

So would you accept matches being postponed due to a lack of officials?

[marky No.1]

So the talk here is obviously about officials at our level...What would you say about the very green twonk who was overruled tonight in the Arsenal game by one of the normally unused officials behind the goal.
Talk about spoiling a game that was already gone by being totally outclassed

10.2 now

[Shrimp Girl]

I know Darren Drysdale has made poor decisions at our games in the past, but I thought his performance yesterday (Shrimps/Wycombe) was one of the better reffing displays at the Globe this season. He signalled his decisions clearly and kept the game moving. Perhaps not the toughest game to officiate but still, worth a brownie point. More of the same next season please Mr D

[mrpotatohead]

All shrimpgirls comments are always pretty good, this one included, my highlight yesterday was when he went for his pocket after mullers had a tangle with their centre half, both players started to protest but instead of a card, he pulled out a hanky and mopped his brow!!

[fulwoodshrimp]

He wasn't the biased one sided official that he has been in several previous Shrimp games he has refereed. He had a reasonable game.

[paulshrimp]

I thought he had a relatively poor game but the difference was that, apart from the first five minutes, the balance of the bad decisions went in our favour.

[Gone_Shrimping]

I have seen a lot worse refs at The Globe than the one on Saturday.

He should have red carded the guy who assaulted Paul Mullin though.

[Westgate Wanderer]

I have seen a lot worse refs at The Globe than the one on Saturday.

He should have red carded the guy who assaulted Paul Mullin though.

Missed the penalty in the first half when a defender was hugging Kevs hips, a definate red for the assault on the going clear through Mullers. The clear push on one of our defenders before the scrambled rebound for their goal. Apart from that he was ok!

[KenH]

So would you accept matches being postponed due to a lack of officials?

Perhaps they could use some of the huge amounts of money floating around football to train more refs to a better standard and pay them a higher way to make it a more attractive job?