Hitting Rock Bottom

[Ntini]

I never thought this day would come.

I walked away from the Globe on Saturday utterly dejected and despondent and feeling as though I couldn't face seeing my club, that I love dearly, just sleep-walk towards the EFL trapdoor.

I sincerely hope it isn't, but I can't help feeling that Saturday was my last match watching the Shrimps unless something changes.

My departing thoughts as I watched Jim pathetically applaud the supporters, whilst looking like a dog with his tail between his legs, were words I have muttered repeatedly this season and last - same rubbish, different day.

Saturday showed me quite clearly that it isn't the players that are the problem. I genuinely believe I saw some decent football in the second half, but that it's undermined by some terrible tactical decisions and some pretty abject coaching. We began with a formation that just didn't work and we were played off the park by a pretty poor team that repeatedly kicked the ball out of play when trying to find a pass. It took almost 40 minutes for the management team to realise and change things. As soon as we did, we looked a completely different side. When we then get ourselves on top and boss the game, the management team decide to change back to the formation that did not work. That decision only saw us relinquish control over the game, invite pressure back on ourselves and give up the momentum we had, as well as the points. I have no issues over the personnel changes, it was the tactical changes that cost us the points.

So, with time to reflect, I have 3 major issues with the way the management team organise the players:

1. Closing down the opposition

In short, we never do it.
If we ever try, it's individual and it's a lame effort.
A successful team works harder without the ball than with it. When we lose the ball we give up.
We need to start working hard on our fitness, on how to win the ball back effectively, and how to do it as a group across the whole pitch.
No more standing off, waiting to see what the opposition do before throwing ourselves wildly at the ball (often missing the tackle) and then seeing the attacker skip past and expose us.

2. Fitness

I know we currently have injuries across different positions, but as a whole we look unfit, knackered after 20-30 minutes of a match, and unable to compete. And this isn't just when we have injuries, it was the same last season, and it's been there all this season.
Stevenage were missing players and clearly had players carrying niggles, yet they didn't look at all unfit from the first minute to the last. If we can't keep up with the opposition, we can't hope to compete.

3. Passing and crossing

I'm not sure what we work on in training, but this is a basic of the game that we repeatedly get wrong.
All season our crossing has been woeful - from open play as well as from set pieces.
Even more than that, our passing has been as bad as I can remember from a Morecambe team.
We repeatedly sell each other short with passes and forever give the ball away when trying to make short, simple passes out from the back. It's as though we take it for granted and never practice, but more often than not it's linked to the style of our play. When we play 4-4-2 and keep the ball on the ground we're fine. As soon as we play a different formation or try to play long balls, our short game disintegrates.
Too often this season, and last, our forwards have been blamed for not scoring goals. In reality, they have had terrible service from crosses that don't beat the first man, or our play breaks down when the defenders/midfielders can't pass the ball 5-10 yards.


I'm disappointed to say it (I've followed the club through thick and thin since the age of six) but I just can't face watching the same problems week after week. If the management refuses to make way, or if the powers-that-be don't see these weaknesses and do something, then I can't just simply sit in the stand watching us plunge towards the non-league abyss.

It would pain me so much to walk away, but enough is enough.

[marky No.1]

it is very worrying coming from a 'positive' supporter and you are not the only one, there were a few others after the game that are always glass half full and I can sure you they were very much empty, although they were soon back to the bar to refill if that's any consulation.

Seriously though, we are clearly in the do-do and this time around we cannot rely on 2 or 3 other teams being worse than us, which is pretty much what we have had to rely on in previous seasons.

As you say, the way Jim stood looking over at the home terrace at the end with a strange applause as if he was waiting for someone to reply, was very sad to watch.

On Saturday we play Northampton and really have to get something from the game as Cheltenham play Macclesfield in a 6 pointer, so with guaranteed points for either or both, we can pretty much expect to be in the bottom two by 5 o'clock if we don't!

[BerlinWaller]

Never hid my feelings about Jim but I noticed a different kind of atmosphere at the game.

[Seasider9601]

Never hid my feelings about Jim but I noticed a different kind of atmosphere at the game.

From Jim himself do you mean?

[Phoenix Shrimp 2017]

Hello Ntini,

I think your comments echo those of many others and a lot of supporters and ex supporters feel your pain. Watching Morecambe for the past few seasons is by and large like groundhog day where we end up watching the same old dross time after time with very few exceptions. The players may change but the management stays the same and very little changes.I also have a long drive from E Lancs and often spend the return journey reflecting why I'm doing a 90 mile return journey when I haven't enjoyed the experience. Hence I struggle to find the incentive to make the journey for more than a handful of games a season nowadays. At the end of the day we love the club but it's bloody hard at times. I suppose we should support through thick and thin and eventually the good times will return. It might get worse before it gets better but unfortunately more and more are turning their backs on it so we might end up with the return of the grim days of the early 80's. It's very much like Brexit at the moment no one knows where the hell we are heading.

[BerlinWaller]

Never hid my feelings about Jim but I noticed a different kind of atmosphere at the game.

From Jim himself do you mean?

No, towards Jim

[fulwoodshrimp]

I completely agree with Ntini. The number of late goals we concede suggest to me we are not fit enough as a team and the abysmal crossing suggests we don't practice crossing in training. I thought first half on Saturday we were as poor a team as we have seen at the Globe Arena since we joined the Football League. We played like the players had just met and had never trained together. If nothing changes tactically we are going down.

[Slanester]

Ntini
It is obvious from your post that you are a passionate, and knowledgeable, Morecambe football supporter. I understand your frustration 100%, and also share your feeling of desire to see things improve as quickly as possible.
My question is, and just to stress, I am not looking to court contreversy.
Can your 3 major issues, which all have some merit, be pinned squarely on the shoulders of the management team, and it’s tactics, decision making etc?
If the simple answer is yes. Then they wouldn’t even be suitable candidates to manage an u11 side, let alone Div 2, such are the basics of what you mention.
Surely, the players, and with all due respect to them, the quality of player, must have some correlation in relation to our problems??
Hope you keep up your support, as at the minute, we need every person we can.

[Gone_Shrimping]

The last 2 home games we have conceded goals in the 94th minute that have cost us 3 points(2+1)

Other games where late goals have cost us points are Port Vale (2 points ) Cheltenham (2 points) Tranmere (2 points). There will probably be others but add the 9 points above to our total and 37 would have us nicely mid-table. For me this "game management" Jim talks about is just bullshit. The best game management is when you are 2-0 up go for a 3rd and then a 4th. If you sit back you get trouble.

[marky No.1]

Particularly when its taken us since mid November to get 9 points on the board!

[redrobo]

I have to come to the defence of our manager on the subject of the subs used on Saturday.

Oates had to come off due to him running on an empty tank. Manders was off his game and was in my opinion a tactical sub, but the managers bench options were limited.

On the bench remaining we had Hedley a reserve teamer and a youth team striker his name escapes me at the moment plus a goalkeeper.

So our options were limited, hence why we need some new blood in this transfer window BUT will the new owners release funds from the Oswell deal....and just as important the money will not I suspect be mega bucks so the quality of new signings could be limited unless we can get a decent experienced loan player in, not for me a Development squad player of even worse a youth team player but it might not be that easy.

[RedRampage]

I was speaking to an Ex Shrimp this morning who actually played with Jim for 3 seasons. Not naming him.
He was at the game on Saturday, it is the 1st time he has been for a while he said, but he was very disheartened by the performance of the team. He said the team looked like they seriously lacked passion and drive , and he actually couldn't believe how bad it has got.

He said he wouldn't be returning in a hurry! He has followed the other 1000+ fans who can no longer be bothered to drag their selves to watch the same shower of sh*te every week.

There is only one solution for a turnaround, and we all know what that solution is! Jim Must walk away NOW!

He is not the man for the job, and hasn't been for 4 years.

The bad news, is that I don't think the owners actually care about this club, and are only here for the land.

Bad times ahead !

[Ntini]

Ntini
My question is, and just to stress, I am not looking to court contreversy.
Can your 3 major issues, which all have some merit, be pinned squarely on the shoulders of the management team, and it’s tactics, decision making etc?
If the simple answer is yes. Then they wouldn’t even be suitable candidates to manage an u11 side, let alone Div 2, such are the basics of what you mention.
Surely, the players, and with all due respect to them, the quality of player, must have some correlation in relation to our problems??

Firstly, I have no problem in anyone questioning my posts. I'd be a pretty poor conversationalist on a message board if I did!
I think the answer to your question is indeed yes, however I'm not sure it's a simple, straightforward answer.

I've noticed players that when they first came to the club played in one way, and now appear to be playing completely differently. Take Steve Old as an example (a player who I admire for his approach to the game and his invaluable defensive experience at international level). When he came to the club he was a no-nonsense guy who would hustle the opponent, not let a man past him and stick it in row Z. Now he stands off a man, gets beaten and then turns to the ref to shout abuse at as the only viable candidate for blame (sound like anyone we know off the pitch?) Look at Mandeville, from when he joined us to now that he's 'match fit'.

These problems have also persisted across many players that have played for us over the past few seasons. They don't all come to us unable to win the ball back quickly, unable to last 90 minutes and so poor at crossing and passing.

Of course the players have a role in this, but they are coached and directed by the management team who load the ship, pick the crew and steer it on the course they see fit.

[Ntini]

I have to come to the defence of our manager on the subject of the subs used on Saturday.

Oates had to come off due to him running on an empty tank. Manders was off his game and was in my opinion a tactical sub, but the managers bench options were limited.

On the bench remaining we had Hedley a reserve teamer and a youth team striker his name escapes me at the moment plus a goalkeeper.

Others may have said that Oates shouldn't have been taken off, but perhaps have another read of my post. I didn't. My issue with the end of the game on Saturday was that Jim returned to a formation that worked horrendously for us. I have no issues with the personnel, or the timing, just the tactics.

As for Hedley, you must have missed the game at home earlier in the season where he started and looked pretty comfortable in the centre of the park. Yes, he made a few mistakes, but also had a couple of chances and nearly scored before being taken off. Not bad for a young lad in my opinion. With a bit more game time he might have come on a bit more, but then Cranston stepped in and has done a solid job for us in midfield.

[Slanester]

Ntini
My question is, and just to stress, I am not looking to court contreversy.
Can your 3 major issues, which all have some merit, be pinned squarely on the shoulders of the management team, and it’s tactics, decision making etc?
If the simple answer is yes. Then they wouldn’t even be suitable candidates to manage an u11 side, let alone Div 2, such are the basics of what you mention.
Surely, the players, and with all due respect to them, the quality of player, must have some correlation in relation to our problems??

Firstly, I have no problem in anyone questioning my posts. I'd be a pretty poor conversationalist on a message board if I did!
I think the answer to your question is indeed yes, however I'm not sure it's a simple, straightforward answer.

I've noticed players that when they first came to the club played in one way, and now appear to be playing completely differently. Take Steve Old as an example (a player who I admire for his approach to the game and his invaluable defensive experience at international level). When he came to the club he was a no-nonsense guy who would hustle the opponent, not let a man past him and stick it in row Z. Now he stands off a man, gets beaten and then turns to the ref to shout abuse at as the only viable candidate for blame (sound like anyone we know off the pitch?) Look at Mandeville, from when he joined us to now that he's 'match fit'.

These problems have also persisted across many players that have played for us over the past few seasons. They don't all come to us unable to win the ball back quickly, unable to last 90 minutes and so poor at crossing and passing.

Of course the players have a role in this, but they are coached and directed by the management team who load the ship, pick the crew and steer it on the course they see fit.

I opened my post politely, not to question your conversationalist skills, just to set my tone, that I wasn’t trying to set up a war of words.

From your reply to my question, it is obvious that your opinion and decision with regard the management team are firmly made. Something,that we are all quite rightly entitled to do, and I am certainly not going to tell you that you are wrong, and try to convince you otherwise.

However things play out for MFC with regard the managerial position. I sincerely hope that it ends positively for us all. Not too blinkered to hold my breath though.

[redrobo]

Although the following isn't about 'hitting rock bottom' there is an on going issue that does concern me and that is about the non show on match day of all our walking wounded. For me they have an obligation to the fans to be at all home games if only to be seen mixing with all sections of the ground to build on a rapport between the players and the fans.

It's often been mentioned that at times that it feels like 'them and us' and surely one way to show that we are ALL in this together is for those non playing players to mingle with ALL fans irrespective of where fans watch the game from and in particular those in the home end who are vocal in their encouragement of their heroes on the park.

For instance when did we last see Oliver at the ground or for that matter Cuvelier and Sinclair all of whom I expect are still being paid by the club. Despite injury to many it still is no excuse not to be present on match days.

This is only my opinion and no doubt others have different opinions.

[Andy D]

there's only Money Bag's Notts County who are worse than us now, Potless Macclesfield under Sol Campbell will overtake us going by current form.

just hoping Richie Bennett can save us.

[Westgate Wanderer]

Ntini
My question is, and just to stress, I am not looking to court contreversy.
Can your 3 major issues, which all have some merit, be pinned squarely on the shoulders of the management team, and it’s tactics, decision making etc?
If the simple answer is yes. Then they wouldn’t even be suitable candidates to manage an u11 side, let alone Div 2, such are the basics of what you mention.
Surely, the players, and with all due respect to them, the quality of player, must have some correlation in relation to our problems??

Firstly, I have no problem in anyone questioning my posts. I'd be a pretty poor conversationalist on a message board if I did!
I think the answer to your question is indeed yes, however I'm not sure it's a simple, straightforward answer.

I've noticed players that when they first came to the club played in one way, and now appear to be playing completely differently. Take Steve Old as an example (a player who I admire for his approach to the game and his invaluable defensive experience at international level). When he came to the club he was a no-nonsense guy who would hustle the opponent, not let a man past him and stick it in row Z. Now he stands off a man, gets beaten and then turns to the ref to shout abuse at as the only viable candidate for blame (sound like anyone we know off the pitch?) Look at Mandeville, from when he joined us to now that he's 'match fit'.

These problems have also persisted across many players that have played for us over the past few seasons. They don't all come to us unable to win the ball back quickly, unable to last 90 minutes and so poor at crossing and passing.

Of course the players have a role in this, but they are coached and directed by the management team who load the ship, pick the crew and steer it on the course they see fit.

only one word..... Bentleyfication (sorry Outsider)

[BerlinWaller]

One thing that really stood out for me on Saturday was when Cranston over hit a cross for the 32nd time, nobody in a Red shirt turned to bollock him. They all just turned and jogged back awaiting the goal kick. The players aren't playing for the shirt, the manager or the fans. When Macc over take us, we are doomed.

[marky No.1]

Ben Hedley also scored our only goal at Wigan last week, give him a game, with all respect we aint going to score many with Oates up front

[black morse]

Haven't seen many of our matches over the years but I can't remember one where we didn't back off and give the opposition room to play. As that spreads over years it is different players and I don't see how it can be anything other than a management decision.

I believe Jim has done extremely well bringing in some very good players with the budget he has and, as stated above, many of them start off looking very promising but after a while they seem to lose their edge.

[Posh]

I’m with Ntini on feeling utterly depressed after the game. After a poor result i’m always confident that we can bounce back but that’s the first time I’ve left the ground thinking that this is the beginning of the end.

The factors behind it are simple. Injuries - just so many of them. No strikers and no options up front. No money - all the stuff about clearing debts is nonsense, we’ve just got the new owners debt instead and no extra cash. No soul - the new owners aren’t fans and it shows. No passion - I think players like Mandeville and Oliver aren’t up for fight ahead. No answers - I think Jim and Ken have run out of ideas. In the past we’ve had a few players who can make a difference but we haven’t in this lot. We’re relying on a soon to be 40 year old for goals and passion and two full backs in midfield. No one worse. Surely Notts County will buy their way out of trouble and everyone else seems to be scraping results. No safety net. Yes relegation would see us get parachute payments but our income will still be less than well supported or sugar daddy sides. We could easily do a York or Stockport but they have decent crowds, so it could be a Darlington or, sadly, even a Scarborough.

Felt very glum after the game and now just hoping for a miracle.

[Gone_Shrimping]

I’m with Ntini on feeling utterly depressed after the game. After a poor result i’m always confident that we can bounce back but that’s the first time I’ve left the ground thinking that this is the beginning of the end.

The factors behind it are simple. Injuries - just so many of them. No strikers and no options up front. No money - all the stuff about clearing debts is nonsense, we’ve just got the new owners debt instead and no extra cash. No soul - the new owners aren’t fans and it shows. No passion - I think players like Mandeville and Oliver aren’t up for fight ahead. No answers - I think Jim and Ken have run out of ideas. In the past we’ve had a few players who can make a difference but we haven’t in this lot. We’re relying on a soon to be 40 year old for goals and passion and two full backs in midfield. No one worse. Surely Notts County will buy their way out of trouble and everyone else seems to be scraping results. No safety net. Yes relegation would see us get parachute payments but our income will still be less than well supported or sugar daddy sides. We could easily do a York or Stockport but they have decent crowds, so it could be a Darlington or, sadly, even a Scarborough.

Felt very glum after the game and now just hoping for a miracle.

Not only that , if we do go into the Conference , a club only receives funding for their academy for the first 2 seasons down there. Dagenham had to sack their academy manager and all his staff last Summer. That would be a disaster for us.
In the Stevenage programme Jason states "we are now close to securing long term use of training facilities through a local partner of the rugby club , which we hope to announce very soon". This could be like re-arranging the deckchairs on the Titanic after it's hit the iceberg.

[thedoc]

It was poor on Saturday, particularly in the first half. I think we can all understand the general gloom which seems to have settled over club and supporters. It's also understandable that the gut reaction is to blame the Manager for the apparent lack of fitness of our players and for their seeming lack of motivation at times. But - however crap the performances are of late - I come back to the question I have asked myself for years: who will do a better job than Jim? How can anyone expect the players to be fully fit when they have nowhere reliably to train? This fact in itself is absolutely pathetic: even Sunday League clubs often have reliable locations at which to practice.

And what do our friends from Essex say about it all? Burble inanities about how their share in a Rugby Union club miles away from here actually directly benefits the Shrimps. How does that work? Then make muffled hints that something might actually be done about the training facilities at the Globe which have been unavailable for god knows how long. Or maybe at another rugby club somewhere (presumably) the British Isles or at least our solar system.

Maybe we should just give up now and ask Vale of Lune to take over at the Globe. No wonder Jim sounded depressed after the game: I think anybody would be with the cards he has been dealt by a succession of hopeless Chairmen during his entire tenure as the man who ultimately carries the can...

[Phil Anderer]

I too was depressed after Saturday, and walking away from the ground even the equable Mrs A was saying it was about time Jim went. I'm not a knee-jerk reaction, impulsive buyer type - it took me 5 hours to decide to spend £11 on two 3-CD box sets on Friday - that's how non-impulsive I am, but I do think either Jim has to change fundamentally his approach, both on and off the field, or we need someone new with fresh ideas. I appreciate it will probably be someone young, just starting out in his managerial career, as we might struggle to attract an established name, but we have no answers to the questions being posed by the opposition. We never, ever close down, we lack movement off the ball, and balls into the box on Saturday were woeful; these things are down to training and tactics, as they happen season after season, regardless of the players.