Wild Bill wrote:I don't think I have heard any racist abuse at MFC but if there was I'd be happy for the team to walk off.
Phoenix Shrimp 2017 wrote:I think recent incidents at matches have amounted to people booing the taking the knee ceremony. The ceremony seems to be a given at matches now with no sign of it winding down any time soon. I don't class that as racism, more frustration that they have paid to watch a football match, not attend a protest or political rally, so lets just get on with the football. The taking the knee message has been done to death, so in my opinion lets now revert to normal and get on with the sport. Would I boo it? No I wouldn't but I think enough is enough.
If taking the knee is to be with us for ever more (which it now appears) lets get the players out half an hour earlier and recognise some other worthy causes. There are many more to go at.
.tim-sanchez wrote:Phoenix Shrimp 2017 wrote:I think recent incidents at matches have amounted to people booing the taking the knee ceremony. The ceremony seems to be a given at matches now with no sign of it winding down any time soon. I don't class that as racism, more frustration that they have paid to watch a football match, not attend a protest or political rally, so lets just get on with the football. The taking the knee message has been done to death, so in my opinion lets now revert to normal and get on with the sport. Would I boo it? No I wouldn't but I think enough is enough.
If taking the knee is to be with us for ever more (which it now appears) lets get the players out half an hour earlier and recognise some other worthy causes. There are many more to go at.
I can't really understand this argument. Politics has been a part of football forever, and regularly players show their support for a variety of causes. I never hear anyone complain that poppies have been "done to death" despite players showing support for the poppy appeal every single year with "no sign of it winding down". We've had the rainbow laces appeal in the past few weeks as well, minutes silence for people who pass away, prostate cancer, MIND, etc. There are many other causes that already are supported, taking the knee doesn't mean other causes can't be supported.
It's a few seconds before kick-off, it doesn't in any way reduce the amount of time we get to enjoy watching the match, nor does it affect the game itself at all. Players regularly show support for a variety of causes before and during matches, I really don't think taking the knee in support of anti-racism is a big deal. I'd understand more if matches were being reduced to 80 minutes, but the sport is still continuing as normal, it's not remotely interfered with by a few seconds spent kneeling.
Slanester wrote:.tim-sanchez wrote:Phoenix Shrimp 2017 wrote:I think recent incidents at matches have amounted to people booing the taking the knee ceremony. The ceremony seems to be a given at matches now with no sign of it winding down any time soon. I don't class that as racism, more frustration that they have paid to watch a football match, not attend a protest or political rally, so lets just get on with the football. The taking the knee message has been done to death, so in my opinion lets now revert to normal and get on with the sport. Would I boo it? No I wouldn't but I think enough is enough.
If taking the knee is to be with us for ever more (which it now appears) lets get the players out half an hour earlier and recognise some other worthy causes. There are many more to go at.
I can't really understand this argument. Politics has been a part of football forever, and regularly players show their support for a variety of causes. I never hear anyone complain that poppies have been "done to death" despite players showing support for the poppy appeal every single year with "no sign of it winding down". We've had the rainbow laces appeal in the past few weeks as well, minutes silence for people who pass away, prostate cancer, MIND, etc. There are many other causes that already are supported, taking the knee doesn't mean other causes can't be supported.
It's a few seconds before kick-off, it doesn't in any way reduce the amount of time we get to enjoy watching the match, nor does it affect the game itself at all. Players regularly show support for a variety of causes before and during matches, I really don't think taking the knee in support of anti-racism is a big deal. I'd understand more if matches were being reduced to 80 minutes, but the sport is still continuing as normal, it's not remotely interfered with by a few seconds spent kneeling.
Agree with most of the points you are making ts, but your use of the poppy as “political” is for me, simply wrong. The poppy is representation of respect for the fallen, regardless of colour of skin, race etc.
tim-sanchez wrote:Slanester wrote:.tim-sanchez wrote:
I can't really understand this argument. Politics has been a part of football forever, and regularly players show their support for a variety of causes. I never hear anyone complain that poppies have been "done to death" despite players showing support for the poppy appeal every single year with "no sign of it winding down". We've had the rainbow laces appeal in the past few weeks as well, minutes silence for people who pass away, prostate cancer, MIND, etc. There are many other causes that already are supported, taking the knee doesn't mean other causes can't be supported.
It's a few seconds before kick-off, it doesn't in any way reduce the amount of time we get to enjoy watching the match, nor does it affect the game itself at all. Players regularly show support for a variety of causes before and during matches, I really don't think taking the knee in support of anti-racism is a big deal. I'd understand more if matches were being reduced to 80 minutes, but the sport is still continuing as normal, it's not remotely interfered with by a few seconds spent kneeling.
Agree with most of the points you are making ts, but your use of the poppy as “political” is for me, simply wrong. The poppy is representation of respect for the fallen, regardless of colour of skin, race etc.
I'd make the same point about taking the knee. It's about anti-racism, not about politics, but people can see anything as political if they want to. In the same way rainbow laces isn't a political statement, but instead about respect and tolerance.
My point wasn't really that the poppy is political, but rather players have always taken time out before and during matches to show support for various causes (whether political or not), and this isn't any different. If players take a minute out to respect someone who passed away, wear a poppy on their shirt, show the mind logo on the shirt, we don't question when those campaigns will end, nobody says "enough is enough". I don't see why taking the knee needs a defined end date either.
tim-sanchez wrote:Phoenix Shrimp 2017 wrote:I think recent incidents at matches have amounted to people booing the taking the knee ceremony. The ceremony seems to be a given at matches now with no sign of it winding down any time soon. I don't class that as racism, more frustration that they have paid to watch a football match, not attend a protest or political rally, so lets just get on with the football. The taking the knee message has been done to death, so in my opinion lets now revert to normal and get on with the sport. Would I boo it? No I wouldn't but I think enough is enough.
If taking the knee is to be with us for ever more (which it now appears) lets get the players out half an hour earlier and recognise some other worthy causes. There are many more to go at.
I can't really understand this argument. Politics has been a part of football forever, and regularly players show their support for a variety of causes. I never hear anyone complain that poppies have been "done to death" despite players showing support for the poppy appeal every single year with "no sign of it winding down". We've had the rainbow laces appeal in the past few weeks as well, minutes silence for people who pass away, prostate cancer, MIND, etc. There are many other causes that already are supported, taking the knee doesn't mean other causes can't be supported.
It's a few seconds before kick-off, it doesn't in any way reduce the amount of time we get to enjoy watching the match, nor does it affect the game itself at all. Players regularly show support for a variety of causes before and during matches, I really don't think taking the knee in support of anti-racism is a big deal. I'd understand more if matches were being reduced to 80 minutes, but the sport is still continuing as normal, it's not remotely interfered with by a few seconds spent kneeling.
cragbankshrimp wrote:I'd be fuming if i had made the effort to go to a game and paid the entry fee for the whole team to go off the field because one or a few numpties shout racsist comments. Let the stewards and club do their bit and the players do theirs.
Just my opinion
Phoenix Shrimp 2017 wrote:tim-sanchez wrote:Phoenix Shrimp 2017 wrote:I think recent incidents at matches have amounted to people booing the taking the knee ceremony. The ceremony seems to be a given at matches now with no sign of it winding down any time soon. I don't class that as racism, more frustration that they have paid to watch a football match, not attend a protest or political rally, so lets just get on with the football. The taking the knee message has been done to death, so in my opinion lets now revert to normal and get on with the sport. Would I boo it? No I wouldn't but I think enough is enough.
If taking the knee is to be with us for ever more (which it now appears) lets get the players out half an hour earlier and recognise some other worthy causes. There are many more to go at.
I can't really understand this argument. Politics has been a part of football forever, and regularly players show their support for a variety of causes. I never hear anyone complain that poppies have been "done to death" despite players showing support for the poppy appeal every single year with "no sign of it winding down". We've had the rainbow laces appeal in the past few weeks as well, minutes silence for people who pass away, prostate cancer, MIND, etc. There are many other causes that already are supported, taking the knee doesn't mean other causes can't be supported.
It's a few seconds before kick-off, it doesn't in any way reduce the amount of time we get to enjoy watching the match, nor does it affect the game itself at all. Players regularly show support for a variety of causes before and during matches, I really don't think taking the knee in support of anti-racism is a big deal. I'd understand more if matches were being reduced to 80 minutes, but the sport is still continuing as normal, it's not remotely interfered with by a few seconds spent kneeling.
We do a minutes silence in remembrance of war dead once a season. We do a minutes silence/applause of club notables passing as a one off thing. We don't continue to repeat them before every match. We now do taking a knee before every football match. My argument would be the point has been made, we understand and we agree with the principles behind it. What we don't need is this repeated ad infinitum because it now seems to be counter productive, in so much as it's getting the wrong reaction from some football fans. If it's getting that reaction when a minimal number of fans are in the ground what's going to happen when crowds return to normal. If a few boo it do the players walk off and call the match off?
Ego Tripping wrote:Some of the responses on here just show why its needed. The point is nowhere near being made and to suggest otherwise is idiotic. Racism has been rife in football (and wider society) for years and I would suggest anyone who goes regularly to football matches and says they have not been aware of it are either deaf, blind or part of the problem.
Secondly ‘whataboutary’ is never a valid reason or excuse. There are loads of other valid causes but to suggest they can’t work alongside each other is nonsensical.
Finally on the subject of walking off the pitch I’d leave that decision to those who are receiving the abuse. If they choose to walk off I certainly wouldnt be upset with the players. If they feel that is an appropriate action then we should back them.
Ego Tripping wrote:I’d suggest you read what I wrote again. Certainly not refering to you specifically as you quite clearly say that just because you havent heard it personally it doesnt mean it doesnt happen. I also specifically refer to people being ‘aware’ of racism at football, not necessarily hearing it for themselves.
Phoenix Shrimp 2017 wrote:After attending thousands of matches back into the late sixties I can't ever recall hearing racist chanting/abuse at a match I've been at.
Phoenix Shrimp 2017 wrote:I think recent incidents at matches have amounted to people booing the taking the knee ceremony. The ceremony seems to be a given at matches now with no sign of it winding down any time soon.
Would I boo it? No I wouldn't but I think enough is enough.
RapidShrimp wrote:In my opinion (so take it or leave it!), taking the knee has become synonymous with BLM, which is (unless you’ve been living in an ignorant bliss for this year) an American political organisation with an extremist-like manifesto.
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