Is football in League 1 "clean"

[fulwoodshrimp]

Watching the latest biased decision against the shrimps on Saturday when the referee failed to give a stonewall penalty in stoppage time set me thinking. Are the series of decisions made by referees against us in favour of the big teams simply incompetence or more! Even Plymouth fans on their forum conceded that the ref had missed the penalty decision and who can forget the referee in the Ipswich game gifting them a penalty and then wrongly disallowing a perfectly good Morecambe equaliser. The list goes on and it surely cannot simply be incompetence by the officials could it ? I know I have a suspicious mind but are the bigger teams doing something that we aren't! Do referees receive hospitality at games and do the big clubs provide better hospitality? Are clubs able to give match officials souvenirs? Are referees policed to ensure nothing is going on behind the scenes? If so what form of monitoring goes on? I do accept that the majority of referees are doing their best in a difficult job. I also accept that some referees are not good enough to be refereeing at league level but there have been times this season in particular when I have wondered if the beautiful game is as clean as it should be!

[Keith]

I'm not that cynical, I suspect it is simply human nature, that the referee is more worried about getting it 'wrong' towards the 'big club', so if in doubt, go their way. That, mixed with competency generally, put us at a disadvantage.

But, you can add, we're not a club that has ever 'bent the ear' of the ref. Even after the [non] penalty on Saturday, there weren't any complaints. Admittedly, they were immediately on the attack, so no time, but imagine if that had been Accrington Stanley, their players would still be surrounding the ref now! The FA said they were going to clamp down on referee intimidation, but haven't. As with diving, I'm afraid that if the FA are going to let teams get away with it, we need to join in.

Doncaster away, their keeper literally rugby tackled our forward, and the ref gave them a goal kick. That was the worst decision I think I've ever seen.

[fulwoodshrimp]

I noticed at the end of the game at Plymouth several of our players spoke to the referee at some length. I also don't think I'm being too cynical Keith. In my lifetime several players have been found to have accepted money to throw matches and indeed currently a premiership player is suspended after betting allegations. If referees are a cross section of our society then some of them will be dodgy and open to inducements from bigger clubs. I suspect there is little or no policing of this area. It worries me that promotion and relegation is seriously affected by the referees performances and small clubs like ours suffer.

[Gone_Shrimping]

We have had 2 penalties given against us in 2 home games this season. Some other games like last Saturday teams have been given penalties against us.

Apart from shoot-outs have we been given any penalties so far this season , I can't remember any.

It's hard to believe that no Morecambe player has been fouled in the opposition box or that no opposition defenders have handled the ball inside the penalty area in 21 games !

[fulwoodshrimp]

I find it fascinating "Gone Shrimping" that several Plymouth fans said they thought their penalty was a dive and our claim was a definite penalty. I am also fascinated about what happens when referees make big mistakes. I think the answer to that is nothing happens! It's no wonder the standard of refereeing is abysmal.

[redrobo]

A close friend of mine who looks after club scouts pre match commented recently that the match officials only receive sandwiches pre match and that other clubs provide them with a hot meal or something more substantial than sandwiches and has been commented on by match officials.

Maybe the way that our club cater for match officials could be improved although I would like to think that pre match hospitality for match officials is not linked to what is sometimes seen as favouritism to the opposition.

[Little Shrimp]

It's a bit fanciful all this. They're just pretty crap, there's not really much more to it. Refereeing in this country is a bit of a mess IMO - takes a long time to progress, and you have to deal with some horrendous treatment in the lower leagues/amateur level along the way. Don't go professional until you're Championship level. It's not really a surprise that the standard is poor.

In regards to Plymouth's penalty, the reaction of the players is usually a good tell. Looked like a penalty, and didn't see any of our players give much complaint. Think it was Bedeau who gave it away and, from previous experience, he's one to let the ref know if he thinks he's been hard done to.

[Catte]

IMHO I think there is an unconscious bias towards teams and it not always has to be the size of the team, or where they have been.
When we were in Administration and dispute with the EFL we had some poor calls against us just mad decisions, and we still have one fella who tries to send off Santos every time he refs us, twice now his Red cards have been rescinded.
And when you move up the leagues, try and get a decision at Old Trafford or Anfield.

in our decision teams like Ipswich (Alf Ramsey and the owners), Sheff Wed (big club) Portsmouth (Happy Harry) seem to get all the decisions.

I suspect we look after the officials with a decent lunch and really good quality referee rooms with Hot showers, but then stuff it up by exposing them to our Manager

[fulwoodshrimp]

I'd like to believe you are right Little Shrimp saying it's because the refs are all crap but if this were so we would get our share of "bad decisions" and we don't. Bedeau did complain at Plymouth and I notice he had a right go at the liner.

[Little Shrimp]

I'd like to believe you are right Little Shrimp saying it's because the refs are all crap but if this were so we would get our share of "bad decisions" and we don't. Bedeau did complain at Plymouth and I notice he had a right go at the liner.

Shaw should have been sent off against Burton, Derby should have had another penalty in the first half but the ref bottled it because it was pretty soon after the first, Stockton handball before he nearly scored against Ipswich (IMO Stockton should have done a bit better, I think he was half expecting the whistle to go).

Granted, I don't think anything has quite matched the levels of the incorrect offside call against Ipswich and the penalty not given at Bolton last season, but we do see some things go in our favour.

Catte probably has a fair point about various unconscious biases slipping into refs, whether it's a big club thing or how they react to certain behaviours etc. Evatt's probably a good example for the latter - some refs will bottle when he goes off on one at them, others will go 'up yours' and lean the other way.

[redrobo]

I'd like to believe you are right Little Shrimp saying it's because the refs are all crap but if this were so we would get our share of "bad decisions" and we don't. Bedeau did complain at Plymouth and I notice he had a right go at the liner.

Shaw should have been sent off against Burton, Derby should have had another penalty in the first half but the ref bottled it because it was pretty soon after the first, Stockton handball before he nearly scored against Ipswich (IMO Stockton should have done a bit better, I think he was half expecting the whistle to go).

Granted, I don't think anything has quite matched the levels of the incorrect offside call against Ipswich and the penalty not given at Bolton last season, but we do see some things go in our favour.

Catte probably has a fair point about various unconscious biases slipping into refs, whether it's a big club thing or how they react to certain behaviours etc. Evatt's probably a good example for the latter - some refs will bottle when he goes off on one at them, others will go 'up yours' and lean the other way.

I'd hate to be the one confronting DA when he goes off on one..... DA is very quick to defend his lads when he feels an injustice has been done and for those who haven't heard DA if full flow then you are missing one highly charged manager.....and we are so privileged to have a manager who looks after his lads on the pitch.

[CityShrimp]

I do think smaller clubs get less decisions going their way. Sean Dyche moaned about this a lot whilst at Burnley. And I do think we are having less luck with referees in league one than we did in league two - now that we are a small fish in an even bigger pond.

I think Derek may have covered this in an interview. The problem is that referees don’t want to take flack - both during the game and after. If there’s a decision that they’re even a bit uncertain of, their instinct is going to be to side with the team that has 20,000 fans in attendance who are otherwise going to kick off, and then slate the ref on social media for a week.

Also - the ref doesn’t want people to think that they’ve affected the outcome of the game. If they give a last minute penalty to a small club who win the game against a massive club, people will be more questioning of the refs decision. If it’s the big club getting the penalty to win the game then people just accept it as being the ‘natural order’ of things that the big club won.

I’m sure that the refs intend to be fair but these factors must creep in subconsciously.

[RedRedWine]

I think the mere suggestion that we don't get many decisions because the club serves match officials sandwiches rather than a hot meal has to be my Shrimpsvoices moment of 2022. Well done Neil

[redrobo]

I think the mere suggestion that we don't get many decisions because the club serves match officials sandwiches rather than a hot meal has to be my Shrimpsvoices moment of 2022. Well done Neil

AS per usual....taken completely out of context.....but nothing unusual in that.

Merry Christmas....